Ace Frehley

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby Vernon » Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:20 pm

Well, us WRONG ones are still sitting around trying to think of a decent riff or solo he put forth. For the life of me I can't think of one song where I had to crank up the stereo to rock out to one of his solos.

And, I think this should be added, KISS attracted a lot of wannabes because they were different and brought with them a sense of rebellion (if you will) . . . hence, the gold records. Of course, aspiring band members wanted to be like Ace but, I don't think it was due to his guitar technique. But, that's just my opinion and, as someone stated earlier, we all know that some ops smell! :wink:[/quote]

Hey Doobie,
Nice to meet you.
Too bad we meet and disagree :)
First let me say...I know there are many more people like you (people that don't like Ace) than fans like me or mrmetal.

When you say Ace never put forth a decent riff or solo and you ask for examples I had to laugh because obviously....I like all of Ace's work.

That's like saying to a fan of The Doors....
"I don't like Jim Morrison......give me examples of his lyrics that actually make sense because his lyrics don't make sense to me".
Well a Doors fan would say "I like all of Jim's lyrics....they all make sense to me".
Same with Ace....I like all of his riffs and solos.

Since Ace is a riff master and all of his songs have great riffs.....I'll concentrate here on some of my favorite Ace guitar solos.
Detroit Rock City.....Shock Me.....Black Diamond......
Great Ace solo work solos would be....Rip It Out....Into The Night....and my favorite Ace works.....Fractured Mirror parts 1 2 and 3.

On to Ace Frehley's song writing being shit....
Totally untrue....
For example....Buckcherry's first big hit.....LIT UP....is nothing more than a direct and blatant rip off of Ace Frehley's Shock Me.
But somehow when Buckcherry blatantly steal and start their career with an Ace song.....
It's somehow cool.
It's not cool to me but Lit Up is a good song only because Shock Me is a great song.

As far as Ace doing nothing for guitar or having no technique....
Also totally untrue.
Ace has such a specific sound and style.....over the past 35 years there
have been countless instuctional books....video's....DVD's....CD's and what ever else.....dealing specifically with "The Ace Frehley Technique".

Including Ace....the band Kiss has had 5 guitar players.
Some of those other 4 guys were much better guitar players than Ace.
Ace is worshiped as a guitar hero and those other 4 guitar players aren't.
That's because Ace is a great player and songwriter.
Ace is a true original.....one of a kind.
Those other 4 players cant hold a candle to him.

Just because people like Joe Satriani and Steve Vai are pompous about their own skill (and they are both great players) doesn't make them better than Ace IMO.
Too bad we can't see who'll be remembered as a true all around guitar hero in 100 years time.
My bet is that Ace will be on that list.
Meanwhile many guitar players that people think are "god" will be long forgotten.

later

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby mrmetal » Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:20 pm

Not to mention Ace did influence Dimebag Darrell... he definitely did not suck.

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby MrScary1971 » Sun Jun 08, 2008 9:58 pm

I like Ace Frehley and his music but I think he is more a product of being in Kiss than anything else. A fine player for sure but nothing exceptionally talented like EVH, Hendrix, Page, SRV etc.. I would say Ace Frehley was to Kiss as Mick Mars is to Motley Crue. Valuable, but not exceptional.

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby Gutterflower » Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:10 am

I have to admit that I've never been a big Kiss fan - they always reminded me of cartoon characters :P But I've seen them live 3X (thanks to an ex who worshipped them), including one of the reunion tours with and then without makeup. Out of all of the original members, I've always liked Ace the best - he seems like the coolest one out of the bunch - I agree with what MrScary ^wrote above me^. But guitar wise - I'd take Jimmy Page, Jake E. Lee or Frank Hannon over him any day :wink:
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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby Doobie » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:13 pm

mrmetal wrote:
Doobie wrote:Well, us WRONG ones are still sitting around trying to think of a decent riff or solo he put forth.


Hmmmm, let me see:

Parasite, Shock Me, Acoustic intro to Rock Bottom, Strange Ways, Breakout, Rip it Out, Talk to Me, Cold Gin, Love Gun...

Nope. No cool or memorable riffs there. :roll:


Well, interestingly enough, none of your picks ended up on the top 25 of this list (not that I entirely agree with this list EITHER :roll: )

(from Melodicrock.com)
WHAT IS THE GREATEST GUITAR RIFF OF ALL TIME?:
A recent internal poll of the students at Guitar-X (www.guitar-x.co.uk), the guitar students at London's prestigious 'Tech Music Schools', has resulted in the following list outlining, in order of popularity, the top 25 guitar riffs of all time to coincide with their 25th anniversary celebrations.
The results of the survey are as follows:
1. Smoke On The Water - Deep Purple (1973)
2. Smells Like Teen Spirit - Nirvana (1991)
3. Walk This Way - Aerosmith (1975)
4. Purple Haze - Jimi Hendrix (1967)
5. Sweet Child O Mine - Guns N Roses (1987)
6. Paradise City - Guns N Roses (1987)
7. Ace Of Spades - Motorhead (1980)
8. Enter Sandman - Metallica (1991)
9. Under The Bridge - Red Hot Chilli Peppers (1992)
10. Welcome To The Jungle - Guns N Roses (1987) 11. Run To The Hills - Iron Maiden (1982) 12. Walk - Pantera (1992) 13. Johnny Be Goode - Chuck Berry (1958) 14. Back In Black - AC/DC (1980) 15. Immigrant Song - Led Zeppelin (1970) 16. Wake Up - Rage Against The Machine (1992) 17. Highway to Hell - AC/DC (1979) 18. My Generation - The Who (1965) 19. 7 Nation Army - The White Stripes (2003) 20. Born To Be Wild - Steppenwolf (1968) 21. Give It Away - Red Hot Chilli Peppers (1991) 22. Paranoid - Black Sabbath (1970) 23. Voodoo Chile (Slight Return) - Jimi Hendrix (1967) 24. Eye Of The Tiger - Survivor (1982) 25. Money For Nothing - Dire Straits (1984)
The big surprise is the fact that with only a few exceptions the riffs were all written more than 20 years ago. Pretty interesting considering many of the students who took part in the survey were not even born when the riffs were recorded. Classic rock has indeed won through here.

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby Doobie » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:16 pm

MrScary1971 wrote:I like Ace Frehley and his music but I think he is more a product of being in Kiss than anything else. A fine player for sure but nothing exceptionally talented like EVH, Hendrix, Page, SRV etc.. I would say Ace Frehley was to Kiss as Mick Mars is to Motley Crue. Valuable, but not exceptional.


Yep, well said. I will give him (and Mick) that much.

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby mrmetal » Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:21 pm

Yeah Doobie, I wouldn't tout that list too much. There is some very lame shit in there. :lol:

I wouldn't mind being a product of Kiss. That is definitely not a negative. Interestingly enough though, Ace had his biggest hits outside of Kiss and out sold them during his solo career. And when I say biggest hits and out sold, I mean by Billboard chart standards, not mine.

And since someone brought up Jake (Linda.... he he), I am sorry, Ace has done more for rock guitar than he has.

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby mrmetal » Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:36 pm

It should also be mentioned that Ace made Guitar World's magazine poll of Greatest Rock Guitarists at #14 in 2004.

And Shock Me was #50 in the 100 Greatest Solos list in a Guitar World magazine poll in 2001.

Kerrang magazine listed Kiss Alive at #21 in the Heaviest Albums of All Time list in 1989.

Now those are lists that I have some faith in....mainly because it agrees with me. :lol:

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby Doobie » Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:19 pm

mrmetal wrote:It should also be mentioned that Ace made Guitar World's magazine poll of Greatest Rock Guitarists at #14 in 2004.


#14?! 8O That's waaaay too high!! Seriously!

Anyway, different strokes man. Different strokes . . . :wink:

As for me I'll go in here and drag out all of my Kiss tapes and give them a listen for a decent riff. Oh, wait! I can't do that . . . I don't own any Kiss tunes :twisted:

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby Doobie » Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:22 pm

mrmetal wrote:Yeah Doobie, I wouldn't tout that list too much. There is some very lame shit in there. :lol:


Yep, three out of the top ten are GNR tunes. What the hell? The English must love them some Slash! :?

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby mrmetal » Mon Jun 09, 2008 7:33 pm

Doobie wrote:
mrmetal wrote:Yeah Doobie, I wouldn't tout that list too much. There is some very lame shit in there. :lol:


Yep, three out of the top ten are GNR tunes. What the hell? The English must love them some Slash! :?


precisely ... what the hell is that? :lol: That isn't what got me.... it was the fucking White Stripes and Nirvana.

What the blazing hell is "Smells Like Team Spirit" doing right under Ritchie Blackmore's legendary "Smoke on the Water" riff???? You got to be kidding me.

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby frethead » Sat Jun 14, 2008 8:49 am

May I say that while growing up and swinging my "Gibson Les Paul Custom with cherry- burst stain and full-binding" TENNIS RACKET around to the great KISS ( Foreigner and Styx) , I was in awe of the "spaceman," wanting to be like him, having a guitar like that to play ( to even be able to PLAY- I didn't start for some years later- 1981) , having cool hair like his, spaceman costume. . . Some years later, I was playing a Les Paul copy, had heard a lot of guitar players, and Spaceman wasn't cutting it up like he had, with me. Kudos to the guy for some neat three and four note ditties, playing in front of a billion people in a thousand cities, and keeping his head on his shoulders through it all. What can I say?! I grew to become disillusioned with "Spaceman," and I'm going to keep growing because . . . I don't know. It happens that I improve.
Incidentally, it has been years upon years, and I do, now, own a 1974 vintage cherry- burst Gibson Les Paul custom with full "deluxe" binding, and a loud, damn good sounding amp. In addition, I have another Gibson Les Paul ( '94 Smartwood) and an '83 Gibson Explorer. May it be known, thus and therefore, the Spaceman influence continues into the twenty- first century, for me. . . :lol:
Everyone will love you, just as long as you are a shooting star.

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby frethead » Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:05 am

O, yeah. Clapton is God. LOLOOLOLLOLLOL
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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby Vernon » Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:22 am

frethead wrote:O, yeah. Clapton is God. LOLOOLOLLOLLOL


Hey Frethead,
You know....I don't know if someone else told you but Clapton really is a sore spot with me :lol:
I'd much rather debate you in person because I have a million bullets for this particular "debate gun" so to speak :)
So I'm gonna just write a few points here....then you can tell me you love him and I won't reply :lol:

First off....Clapton hates Led Zeppelin and Jimmy Page in particular.
He says....He and Cream created heavy meyal music not Jimmy and Zeppelin.He says Jimmy is a one dimentional player that can't even play acoustic guitar.

Answer to Mr. C----Black Sabbath probably created heavy metal as we know it today.Cream heavy metal :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Hates LZ....simply laughable....He's just jelous of the worlds undying love and devotion to them.
Also Jimmy can play acoustic guitar extremely well (my favorite acoustic player).Jimmy and Zep invented the "unplugged" set in the early 70's.
Jimmy has 3 acoustic numbers on Led Zep 1 alone.

Layla is arguably Clapton's "Stairway" and it's only good IMO becaise Duane Allman is playing all the good parts on that song.

Clapton stole his best friends woman (George Harrison).
What a nice guy he is.

I don't even beleive Clapton was a heroin addict in the 70's.
He's the most straight English prude I've ever seen.
He says he was a drug addict just to try to make himself rebelious.

I love Robert Johnson.
So does Eric.Eric is certainly no Robert Johnson and can't play decent renditions of RJ's work to save his own life.
Clapton always sounds like a rich,straight,white guy playing his "blues" to me.He is IMO the >exact< opposite of Robert Johnson.....no matter how hard he tries not to be.

The most deplorable thing he's ever done was to make money and rebuild his sagging career off of the death of his own little boy.
Meanwhile anyone that knows the truth as Clapton himself has said on film...is that Eric was staying at a hotel a few blocks away from where his wife and son were staying.
Real nice guy....real family guy.I guess he loved his son so much he'd rather not be around him.
Eric said himself....on film....that he walked to the crime scene from the seperate hotel he was staying at.

Lastly the most annoying thing EC does....for me...is...
In 95% of his interviews.....he himself....reminds you that people called him "god" 30 years ago.
What a pompous,self centered,egomaniac,media whore.

As you can see....I hate EC as a person so much.....I can't even enjoy his music :lol:
So there's really no need for me to have an EC musical debate about EC because I hate him and try to ignore him.
I can't ignore him because his pompous mouth is louder than his guitar.

Maybe we can have a beer sometime Frethead.
I might be coming to Tampa in the Fall (if you live close by).
I just won't be playing any Clapton on the jukebox. :lol:
later...

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Re: Ace Frehley

Postby mrmetal » Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:55 am

I like some Clapton, the early stuff... but Page blows Eric away....

Cream was also a friggin' pop band, not metal. Deep Purple and Black Sabbath (more Sabbath) are responsible for creating what is Heavy Metal. Power metal borrowed from Purple and the heavier metal copies Sabbath.

What metal riff has been created that wasn't already done by Iommi?

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